September 27, 2005
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
At the EKON conference David I has revealed a lot about the future of Delphi and of the VCL.
At the german EKON9 conference, during its first keynote, David I has shown a slide with a very detailed Delphi roadmap. This doens't cover only the future .net 2.0 support (Highlander), but includes the plan for a native 64-bit compiler and multiple versions of the VCL. for compact framework and Avalon. Bob Swart, who is sitting next to me, has taken a picture of the slide and will post it - I'll add a link here whe it is online. Notice that the diagram had a timescale below, the actual year of each product has been intepreted by me.
The Roadmap
- Dexter (end 2005) will have ECO 3 (with ECO Basic in all Delphi editions), specific support for 64bit .net, a full-blown version of Together for Delphi, focus on performance and quality.
-
Highlander (2006) will support net 2.0 and provide a VCL for .NET 2.0, VCL for Compact Framework, support for 64bit .NET 2.0
-
Delphi for Vista (2007) will include a VCL for Avalon and Indigo support
- Delphi/C++ for win64 (circa 2007): the name says it all
My Comment
I'm very suprised by this level of details. Jason Vokes, who is present (and speaking on Dexter right now, showing the raodmap once more as I type), joked about loosing his job for getting out too many details on future products...
Anyway, I was very pleased by the multiple references to the VCL for .NET. I kept saying that the VCL.NET is not only a tool for Win32 compatibility, for upgrading your existing programs. With multiple new versions coming along (CF, Avalon) the VCL.NET will remain a key feature of Delphi and provide extra value for visual development on .NET. I'm really looking forward to put my hands on these technologies...
Update: Pictures
A picture of the Delphi Roapmap slide is available here (linked with permission of the author!). See more info on http://delphi-notes.blogspot.com/.
20 Comments
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Hello, just a short comment regarding Avalon & Indigo >Delphi for Vista (2007) will include a VCL for Avalon and Indigo support Avalon is now called WPF (Windows Presentation Foundation) and Indigo is WCF (Windows Communication Foundation). Both are parts of WinFX, which will be available also for Windows XPSP2/2003SP1. So IMHO Delphi for Vista should be called Delphi.WinFX or just Delphi 12 (with VCL.WinFX, VCL.Win32 and VCL.Win64) http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1861228,00.asp Best regards, RomanComment by roman on September 27, 13:19
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
This (I hope) will put an end to all the jabberish about Borland abandoning Delphi.Comment by SupportX on September 27, 13:26
These are really good news!
After reading your post about "Delphi roadmap" on the Delphi&Dintorni usergroup, I was quite sure you would have written a few lines here, too. ;-) I think these news about the future of Delphi are really exciting! I am only sad I have to wait before these great features become available... :-) I am also happy that Borland has connected so many platforms and solutions entirely based on VCL, from Win32 to .NET, from CF.NET to Avalon: it's a real proof of the unestimated value of that library (sometimes underestimated, I think, especially nowadays) and a confirmation of the way I perceive VCL.NET: an independent tool to develop new applications while aiding in porting "old" ones. ps: I'll wait for Bob's picture and some detailed news and links to write about it on my extremely unpretentious blog; by the way, it's clear that this site is already listed in my blogrool. :-) Bye, Marco.Comment by Marco Breveglieri [http://www.marco.breveglieri.name] on September 27, 13:48
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Finally I heard a happy news about Delphi's Future :- ) Thank you Marco for these great newsComment by Mohammed Nasman on September 27, 17:25
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
>>This (I hope) will put an end to all the jabberish about Borland abandoning Delphi. what about the community abandoning Delphi? (not because they want to, but because there is no choice) what was the sales drop for Delphi 2005? Microsoft has had (beta) Visual Studio for .NET 2.0 for a while now, does Borland plan anything (free beta versions) like this?Comment by BTX on September 27, 20:30
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Good news! It's a piece of peace at this moment for the delphi developers community to hear about delphi future. Larga vida a delphi!Comment by Juan Antonio Castillo H. [http://www.clubdelphi.com/users/jachguate] on September 27, 20:46
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
It's not the jabberish about Borland abandoning Delphi, it's the management viewing it as a cash cow and so pulling out resources for other grand plans, leading to too little too late for people like me trying to develop not huge enterprise apps. Eco -> architect only until the end of this year and tutorials, demo's etc coming. Compact framework - stymied but resource decision over a VCL and Microsoft on the design tool and something emerging next year Delphi 2005 was desperately poor in terms of quality until the end of the months of patches when it results in a great win32 development tool with all the components etc. though the traditionally dismal help still doesn't work for me even if one could find anything in it. delphibasics.co.uk, MS documentation and delphi.about.com show that it's perfectly possible to do it. All the other things coming much later than the very able team could have done them given the resources and not a management viewing it as a product not for leading. How many talks on the 24 hours of delphi were we're doing that or going to but... resources? Kylix - shelved. Mono support for cross platform? Not highlighted to be easy. Books on D2005 - your very able one. Jobs listing Delphi? USP's of Delphi ECO and Win32? I've used Delphi since version 1, but can't see a justification for using it over visual studio 2005 for dot net development and commercially need to switch. It's frustrating to discover that one's skill set is becoming a minority skill set.Comment by John on September 27, 21:03
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
And who excactly will use Delphi a few years from now? I mean after the current bunch of Delphi experts decide that they no longer need or want to work. Where is the training avalailbility at universities or colleges? Where is the fire of a new generation of enthusiasts? It is almost impossible now to get basic training for it and the start up price of ~AU1600.00 for delphi professional versus the AU$165.00 for VB will keep many people and institutions from using Delphi and opt for Visual Basic.Comment by John Samperi on September 28, 02:00
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Do i understand correct that Delphi for Win32 (not .NET) is dead and there's also no sign of reviving Kylix? That's a big disappointment for me... What i want is worthy follow ups for Delphi 7 and Kylix 3 without the .NET stuff.Comment by Dr. Evil on September 28, 10:51
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
So, we have to wait a year or so, for Highlander just to support .NET 2.0, which will be release in a month. This is ridiculous, developers using C# have access to .NET 2 since its very first, beta stage and will use it months before Delphi users. I think it is time to move to something serious like VS2005, leaving Borland before it's too late.Comment by Ted Nicols on September 28, 14:36
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Good to hear about that. I had been a Delphi developer for long. However though my role has changed drastically I still feel a lot attachment towards Borland's Delphi initiatives. The level of detail shows concrete evidence that Delphi shall be front-runner in RAD for long. ~ShantanuComment by Shantanu S Chauhan [http://godisnear.blogspot.com] on September 28, 16:22
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Hi, I'm not amused .... Where to the hell is CLX? What's about Kylix? What we need is a platform independend IDE for our development. I think, enough is enough. All the promises in past, all the bad quality. We've trusted in the past Borland and switched from C++VisualStudio to Delphi/C++/Kylix hoping to be a little more independend and having more flexibility to fulfill our customers wishes. I think, we will switch with our new product line to . NET/MONO development ... WITHOUT Borland ... maybe CHROME is a good idea. Disappointed regards ChristianComment by Christian Vogt aka PolarKreis [] on September 29, 11:33
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
For 11+ years Borland & Delphi fed me, bought my clothes, my cars and helped pay my rent/mortgage payments... Years ago Borland WAS the best dev tool company that ever graced us with their presence! However, all good things come to an end... It saddens me because I have made several friends at the company, most of whom are gone now. But unfortunately Microsoft leap frogged Borland with .NET and now Borland instead of behing ahead of the industry is now years behind it. With the announcement on the HUGE lapse of time between 2.0's release and Borland's support of 2.0 I think this is the nail in the coffin so to speak. Danny - call me a doomsayer, but buddy, the writing is on the wall, Microsoft WILL (If they haven't already) WIN this one. I've since made the switch to C#/Vs2k5 and frankly I don't at all miss the now-a-days standard shoddy quality Borland has been pushing. Delphi 8 - Originally slated to come complete with Win32/.NET support all in one IDE.. ewups Borland slipped on that one! Delphi 9 - An IDE that is as unstable as Delphi 4... Ewups, guess another missed one... And now the announcement of the length of time it's going to take for 2.0 support? A HUGE miss.... I think best thing Borland has going for them at this point is the VCL... Perhaps a smart decision would be to bite the bullet, forget the idea that they can ever get back in front of Microsoft and instead jump into bed with them... How about building a Delphi compiler that is a plug-in to the VS2k5 IDE? Or how about a VCL library that could be installed into VS2k5 as an add-in? Perhaps Borland could become a compiler/component vendor rather than an IDE/Compiler vendor? (Plus this keeps Danny employed! :>) I'm not trying to hurt any ones feelings or bash and beat-up on Borland, but the fact of the matter is they have several problems that if not fixed soon will eventually lead to their final demise (Yes, I've been around long enough to know that Borland has been considered a sinking ship for along time yet they still manage to hang on.... the question is for how much longer?) I'm trying to be realistic and factual. The facts are: 1) Borland doesn't have any where NEAR the resources that Microsoft has for R&D. 2) Because of #1, the time to market is drastically longer than that of the competition making the products less desirable. The software development industry is a rapidly moving one.... hang on (or even better… lead the way!) or get left in the dust! 3) Borland has lost Dale, Dale seemed to have the ability to get the company back in the black... I know nothing of the new guy, but this most certainly has an affect whether it's negative or positive is up for debate... 4) The quality of the products has gone down hill, and FAST! Delphi 6 is about the last really stable release of Delphi that Borland published. Debugging of COM objects in Delphi 7 is broken and there seems to be no desire to fix it... Delphi 8 was missing half the functionality Borland promised, yet it was still the same price as a full blown release. I think the bottom line is this: The management team at Borland probably needs to be replaced. There have been some absolutely LOUSY decisions in the past that I believe cost the company in the long run. My final statement and it's one that I say with some difficult for sentimental reasons: Borland & Delphi: What's the point? Why use a product that is as far behind the curve as Delphi is? I'm sorry to say it, but sentiments don't pay my bills and finding a Delphi job is more and more of a challenge. In my opinion Delphi's once clean, easy to read and beautiful syntax has been decimated to fit with .NET. It's unfortunate, and some (many?) may disagree with me, but it really feels like Delphi was HACKED to work with .NET :( Sorry for the negative post, but it's what happens when people are honest about their experiences in the industry. Have a nice day. Eric A once loyal Borland/Delphi BIGOT gone to the borg!Comment by Eric on October 5, 19:36
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
I don't use delphi for work but i'll still use it until is not anymore possible. Anyway there's many alternative coming as chrome and i understand professional workers who switch to vs, but if it's your hobby and passion there's no reasons for now. Delphi/Object Pascal is not equal to Borland, see the freepascal/lazarus alternative. Maybe go away is the "easy" way except for pro which don't have choice for keep their work.Comment by farcodev [http://farcolony.sourceforge.net/index_en.html] on October 8, 17:01
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
64-compiler for 2007? .net?? i think they are doing things the wrong way. What about kylix? maybe .net is the future, i don't know. But at this moment, i'll give a chance to FPC/Lazarus. I'll stay with kylix 3/delphi 7 for my actual proyects, and if some proyect of the future fits fpc, i'll switch to it. This roadmap is bad news for the delphi comunity in my opinion.Comment by Locurasbeach on October 24, 15:01
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
.net still being regarded as higher priority than a 64-bit compiler? This is not a good decision, in my opinion. We need 64-bit capability *now*.Comment by Thor Bjørne Masdal on October 26, 13:30
Delphi Roadmap - Feedback
well now. I'm glad the roadmap shows that D.2006 will have load up options so Win32/VCL programmers dont have to be bloated out with .NET and other stuff (unless they ask for it).. The otherwise excellent Delphi Win32/VCL product has been damaged by Borland trying to rush in all the MS .Net bloatware. Why do i have to pay so high a price and sit there waiting it to load up all .Net stuff. We, like others have good, efficient (small footprint) comercial apps without .Net Ok, so perhaps Borland needs a .Net enabled product, i may even need it one day, but do it right & not at the expense of screwing up the product. It seems bill gates & co are punching below the belt with .Net release timing though. Programs can't try to be all things to all people. You can find a good sofa and a good bed but when can you find a really good sofabed thats not too big, heavy, uncomfortable and expensive? Footnote, on the basis of the roadmap i'm sticking with borland & pre-ordered Delphi 2006 but the proof of pudding is in the eating as they say here in the UK. :)Comment by dean robinson [http://www.transactor.co.uk] on October 27, 17:38
Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
I have been a really enthusiastic Delphi developer since D1, but I am now migrating to C# and Microsoft Visual Studio 2005. Delphi 1.0 was my first introduction to Windows programming, and I loved the Object Pascal language. One thing that always remained somthing of a disadvantage though, when using the Win32 API, is that I have never programmed in C or (Intel Assembly. Writing high quality code utilizing pointers, has always reqired full conscious effort, and often some revision. Now that the foundation for Windows programming is changing in a huge way, I have an opportunity to master the language (i.e. C#) with which this foundation is being written (the new parts anyway). Although other languages can be used for WinFX/.Net programming, it seems clear that C# offers advantages that modified older languages will not. After observing what Borland has done (or rather, not done) over the past couple of years, I can only conclude that a WinFX compatible Object Pascal will become ever less mainstream, and less marketable. I live close to two bookstores, with large computing sections, and there is virtually nothing on the shelves on Delphi anymore. There are lots of books on C# related programming though! It is not enough that a language is compatible with Win32 or WinFX, it is also especially important that there are lots of online examples for unfamiliar coding. Undoubtedly, this is one area in which C# excells, and will continue to excell. There are numerous examples of Object Pascal for Win32 programming, but can any Delphi progammer honestly say that they expect to see a similar volume of Object Pascal examples for WinFX? Another thing which concerns me is large, "do everything", development environments, which are too complex to run reliably, and so slow to produce, that they are already behind the technology before they are released. Microsoft has succeeded in leading the whole .Net/WinFX tools environment, because it has vastly more resources than Borland has at its disposal. Recent Delphi releases have indicated that Borland is struggling to cope, and product quality is in a nose dive. I really wish Borland hadn't gone down the route of "do everything" environments. It has resulted in them becoming so unwieldy and buggy, as to be almost unuseable. I for one, would like to see simpler, more focused, leading edge, products. I can't wait around for this to happen though, or even wait around in the hopes of hearing from Borland what its actual plans are. The action has moved to Visual Studio, and C#, and Microsoft tools are surely going to lead and dominate the Windows software industry for many years to come.Comment by S R Knight on December 25, 23:24
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Delphi Roadmap (by David I)
Comment by John on September 27, 13:04